Gate / Admission Finger Scanning going away?

Sleeping Beauty 5 · Post by **Sleeping Beauty 5** » Mar Fri 28, 2008 12:14 pm

I hate the finger scans..I always feel like it's a hassle since I don't really believe that they do anything to match you up with your ticket. But I definitely don't want them to start making us whip out our ID's...sorry but I hate standing behind the moms with the giant strollers and waiting for that to go through the "security" checkpoints.

meticulus9 · Post by **meticulus9** » Mar Fri 28, 2008 5:43 pm

bingo thats why im ok with the scan. waiting for the famliy of 10 @ the gate would be insane!

coasterphil · Post by **coasterphil** » Mar Fri 28, 2008 9:14 pm

There is a lot of misinformation about the system in this thread so hopefully I can clear some things up for you all.

1. The system is not going to be eliminated in the near future. The reason it was off is because managers can have it shut off in order to facilitate better crowd flow through the turnstiles. Since it has been busy the past few weeks due to Spring Break that was almost certainly the reason they were turned off when the OP's relatives came to the gates. Magic Kingdom turns their system off nearly every morning due to crowds, but it has nothing to do with any test of eliminating the system and other parks will also have their systems off at times (just not as often as MK, due to the obvious differences in crowds).

2. Every ticket, save for certain comps and tickets purchased for youth groups, requires use of the biometric scan. Doesn't matter if its one day or ten, Disney needs to know that only one person is using that ticket for as long as it's good for. For anyone who doesn't see why they need it on one day passes, it makes sure that you are the same person that used it earlier if you leave the park and come back. (eliminating the need to stamp you as you exit and making it much harder to pass tickets off to someone else).

3. You don't have to have your finger scanned if you have a photo ID, just make sure you have your name on the ticket. Remember, the system isn't to make sure you are "OK" as far as security/safety/whatever is concerned, just that it is your ticket and not someone else's. If you aren't willing to put your name on the ticket, please don't try to show your ID as that defeats the whole purpose of why Disney put the system in place.

4. The finger scans generally work much better than you guys think they do. Sure they aren't 100% accurate, since guests never put their finger in the same exact spot they can't set it to measure so acutely, but the finger has to be pretty similar for it to work. Those of you who got in on someone else's pass likely purchased your tickets together. The tickets are supposed to recognize the finger of anyone in that group of tickets, though the reliability of that feature is spotty at best and may require a few attempts, so please try to remember which ticket is yours. As far as overriding or resetting the system if the scan doesn't match, CM's really aren't that strict about it. It isn't worth trying to fight to get the guest to try another finger or think about what they did previously (imagine that, some guests are impatient and refuse to listen and just complain!

), so if the name matches the normal ticket/they have an ID for the AP it'll get reset.

Overall, the system is far from perfect and Disney could take steps to improve it and the way they communicate about the scanning process with the guests. Don't ask me why they don't, though if I had to guess it has to do with money and the fact that they don't have enough complaints to put it near the top of their to-do list. If they just explained it and the way it works to guests when they purchase tickets it would eliminate most of the guests' errors and a lot of the paranoia associated with it. It isn't taking your fingerprint, identifying who you are, and then cross checking it against several background databases. It just make sure the same measurement shows up on that piece of glass every time the ticket goes in.

My suggestion to you all, if you have the room key type plastic cards make sure you are always using the one with your name on it and stick with the right index finger. If you have paper tickets, write your name on it immediately and make sure you use the same one at all times with your right index finger. If you have to use another finger for some reason, put it on the card so you'll remember (for example RM, for right middle). If you do those things I bet you'll have close to zero problems with the system and if something does happen, having your name on the ticket assures that the CM can reset it without a problem. Also (this really doesn't have to do with the biometric system but since we are talking tickets I figured I'd throw it in anyway) remember to keep the tickets away from cell phones/cameras/anything magnetic and that you can insert them any way into the turnstile that you please since it reads no matter what the direction.

I ended up rambling a bit in here, but hopefully I've been able to give you all a clearer picture of the system. If you have any more questions feel free to ask them.

DisBeamer · Post by **DisBeamer** » Mar Fri 28, 2008 10:19 pm

I really don't mind the finger scan all that much. I think it's better now that it does the 'several points' impression of one fingerprint rather than the distance between joints in two fingers or whatever the old way was; seems to work more reliably. They could definitely do a better job educating people a) what they're supposed to do and b) why, though. I also think it'd be better/faster/easier if there was just a picture on the passes (at least on the multi-day ones), but I have to agree with those who say they prefer the scan to showing id.

Apart from the extra time it'd take for people to be taking out/fishing around for id, what would you show to identify people who don't have id? I'm thinking kids who don't drive yet and the like. Since you pay full price on a ticket if you're over 10 (it is 10, right?), it seems they'd want those tickets to be just as 'secure'.

Captain Schnemo · Post by **Captain Schnemo** » Mar Sat 29, 2008 2:52 am

If they have to turn it off when there are a lot of people, it seems pretty clear that the system is inefficient and should be replaced.

ghostelias · Post by **ghostelias** » Mar Sat 29, 2008 8:08 am

I always thought the fingerscan was a rubbish idea. For Annual Passes they should just put a photo on the pass. It would save a lot of problems for the people who visit the parks to most.

samuraiblue · Post by **samuraiblue** » Mar Sat 29, 2008 7:29 pm

ghostelias wrote:I always thought the fingerscan was a rubbish idea. For Annual Passes they should just put a photo on the pass. It would save a lot of problems for the people who visit the parks to most.

Sounds similar to what Universal Did. One Year, they had plastic Annual Passes issued with photos and everything, but that has since been replaced with Paper Passes, No longer with photos, but IDs are needed. That's meant to save costs alone.

To be completely honest, the whole biometric scan for day passes is to make sure that when someone purchases a ticket, they aren't getting 20 people in behind them on that one ticket. Printed names help, Photos are even better, but its just not as easy or time-efficient as a simple biometric scan of a finger.

jcodirewolf · Post by **jcodirewolf** » Apr Tue 01, 2008 7:06 am

coasterphil wrote: 4. The finger scans generally work much better than you guys think they do. Sure they aren't 100% accurate, since guests never put their finger in the same exact spot they can't set it to measure so acutely, but the finger has to be pretty similar for it to work.

I hate to tell you this but no they don't work very well. I can point to some research that was done a few years ago, I think at CMU, which came to the conculstion they all pretty much suck. Or you can see what the mythbusters have done.

Now then it might work well enough. It also may be working in a different way. The printscanners are just enough of a barrier that people who would have bought tickets, might think twice because of the scanner. The image of security is often as good and cheaper than the real thing. Same reason people who don't have alarm systems buy the "monitored by" stickers for their windows, or post "beware of dog" even though they don't have a puppy.

coasterphil wrote: Those of you who got in on someone else's pass likely purchased your tickets together. The tickets are supposed to recognize the finger of anyone in that group of tickets, though the reliability of that feature is spotty at best and may require a few attempts, so please try to remember which ticket is yours.

Simple hack which should work reasonably well. You could also "watch" who you enter with. To gather that data.

coasterphil wrote: As far as overriding or resetting the system if the scan doesn't match, CM's really aren't that strict about it. It isn't worth trying to fight to get the guest to try another finger or think about what they did previously (imagine that, some guests are impatient and refuse to listen and just complain! ), so if the name matches the normal ticket/they have an ID for the AP it'll get reset.

Or if you can spell your last name. Yes I've even had them see I have an AP, and just 'buzz" me in while they are working with someone else who doesn't understand the procedure.

coasterphil wrote: Overall, the system is far from perfect and Disney could take steps to improve it and the way they communicate about the scanning process with the guests. Don't ask me why they don't, though if I had to guess it has to do with money and the fact that they don't have enough complaints to put it near the top of their to-do list.

I'm sure it's 100% economic. They know how many complaints they get per 1000 guests. I'm sure they know how how much it costs them to run it. And they have an idea of how much fraud it prevents (something NOT done is hard to measure, but I'm sure they have a ballpark number.) So the math just falls out.

Not that the MBTA is a great model of this. But last year they cut over from tokens to mag stripe cards. And as they replaced the turnstiles in the underground stops, they just opened up the stops, you could ride for free from that stop till they got it cut over and operational, several stops where that way for weeks. But they claimed the cost of fixing it so everyone paid was much higher than the revenue they lost by just having an open station for a bit.

johno

meticulus9 · Post by **meticulus9** » Apr Tue 01, 2008 8:03 am

the gate scanners are not supposed to be a security measure. they are supposed to "make sure" that your tickets is yours not a black market one.

packwingfn · Post by **packwingfn** » Apr Wed 02, 2008 8:59 pm

I'm fine with it, I wouldnt want to see Disney's tickets appear to be scalped and stuff. I like playing the game of what line will move faster than the other haha.

Post by **Dr. Ravenscroft** » Apr Thu 03, 2008 11:18 am

packwingfn wrote:I'm fine with it, I wouldnt want to see Disney's tickets appear to be scalped and stuff. I like playing the game of what line will move faster than the other haha.

Yeah the line with the single men goes fastest (according to the Simpsons).

DisBeamer · Post by **DisBeamer** » Apr Thu 03, 2008 9:08 pm

Dr. Ravenscroft wrote:
packwingfn wrote:I'm fine with it, I wouldnt want to see Disney's tickets appear to be scalped and stuff. I like playing the game of what line will move faster than the other haha.
Yeah the line with the single men goes fastest (according to the Simpsons).

Only cash (or in this case, passes), no chitchat?

secondstar · Post by **secondstar** » Apr Fri 04, 2008 9:56 pm

I'm not a big fan of the finger scan because it usually results in delays when people can't get things figured out. It seems, I'm always in the line with a problem just a few people ahead of us.

tmptnr · Post by **tmptnr** » Apr Thu 17, 2008 12:11 am

I have an annual pass and I have to scann my finger before entering. not really sure for day and park hoppers. I would think they should keep it for pass holders, becuase if there was no other way to ID us we would need to show our Photo ID and if you have a resident pass our H2O bill. I dont want to have to take my H2O bill to the park. Overall though.... I think having everyone do the print ID it slows everything down.... it's also a good croud controll i guess too..

cccmouse · Post by **cccmouse** » Apr Thu 17, 2008 6:14 am

I would love to see the finger scan go away. I always wind up in line behind the guy who just can't figure it out. Plus, where have all those fingers been? Yuck!