What EPCOT refurb never should have happened?

mindflipper · Post by **mindflipper** » Nov Mon 09, 2009 11:13 am

In judging Mission: Space, MmeLeota, you may want to ride both versions: one with centrifuge, and the one without it. To me, the centrifuge is more "annoying" than "thrilling". Also, for ride is a very cramped space, so if anyone suffers from claustrophobia, this ride is not for you (or if its not too bad, you may want to consider the one without the centrifuge). They have coded as two different color "teams" to differentiate which one spins and which one does not.

MmeLeota · Post by **MmeLeota** » Nov Mon 09, 2009 12:27 pm

Hmmm...claustrophobia, huh? So far the only attraction I absolutely cannot do is the subs. Also, I cannot stand Indy's queue line.

How would it be in comparison? Maybe I won't even try it....no sense if I won't enjoy it, right?

However, I have no clue when I will make it to WDW...

mindflipper · Post by **mindflipper** » Nov Mon 09, 2009 12:36 pm

MmeLeota, to give you idea of the space within the "capsule", I found this photo on FLICKR:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rockyroad/1881068471/

The console is not far away from where you sit.

keneka · Post by **keneka** » Nov Tue 10, 2009 5:27 am

El Rio del Tiempo, I know it was a bit dated but I liked it and the music and after they have redone it now it seems to kiddy with The Three Caballeros (plus what kids even know who the Three Caballeros are as it was released in 1944)

MmeLeota · Post by **MmeLeota** » Nov Tue 10, 2009 9:10 am

I loved the music from El Rio, and I miss it....granted, the kids may not know the Three Caballeros, but A) they know Donald and B) I'm glad that there is something acknowleding them. It keeps the classic alive. (they added them to IASW in DL)

...of course, I have not ridden it so I can't say anything else...it might have been nice for the Caballeros to be added in and not completely take over.

Future Guy · Post by **Future Guy** » Nov Tue 10, 2009 9:14 am

I really hate it that the WOL pavilion is just sitting there unused, but the place needed a serious overhaul. Someone in another forum said that its late-80s interior design sensibility made you feel like you were trapped in an episode of Clarissa Explains It All, and I agree with them.

Jacca5660 · Post by **Jacca5660** » Nov Tue 10, 2009 5:21 pm

keneka wrote:El Rio del Tiempo, I know it was a bit dated but I liked it and the music and after they have redone it now it seems to kiddy with The Three Caballeros (plus what kids even know who the Three Caballeros are as it was released in 1944)

I agree, it was fun and a great break from the heat. It's become another, how many icons can we put in one place ride. I'm waiting for Goofy to show up in Maelstrom.

If they do that PLEASE DON"T BLAME ME!!

asmaha · Post by **asmaha** » Nov Fri 27, 2009 9:16 pm

I get angry every time I pass the Odyssey building. Prime real estate just sitting there!

Admiral01 · Post by **Admiral01** » Dec Sun 06, 2009 3:23 pm

Odyssey does seem like it could be converted into something useful. Maybe the for-rent space is all Disney wants and needs from the building. Each time I am at EPCOT they are either setting up or taking down from an event at the Odyssey.

However, it is a prime location on the border of Future World and World Showcase. Plus the restrooms are great...its become our usual stopping point.

As for WoL, I walked around it for a good hour in October. I overheard a dozen conversations that included "this used to be..." Surprisingly, I heard the same sort of conversations about JII. I always complain about it, but I was under the impression that the group of us who greatly dislikes the new versions because we remember the old version is not that large. I got to listen to a girl, my age (late 20s), on PotC describe to her boyfriend what JII used to be. I was so happy, because it was the EXACT same conversation that I have with my girlfriend each time we walk by the pyramids. Then, later in the day, I heard the same conversation between different people while waiting in line for Soarin.

Maybe once the generation who grew up with EPCOT Center comes of age where we are taken seriously some positive changes may come to WDW. We remember the glory of EPCOT, and we all recognize what is wrong. It isn't just complaining, it is constructuve critisizm from a group of people who have grown up with EPCOT. Again, what does Nemo have to do with Future World? Absolutly nothing. There is nothing living about the Seas anymore. Just a lost clown fish (again) and some plasma screens built into scenery. Does anyone actually know there are real live fish in the building until the very end? Worst ride design, execution, and theming ever. Future World...

Future Guy · Post by **Future Guy** » Dec Mon 07, 2009 5:29 pm

Admiral01 wrote: Maybe once the generation who grew up with EPCOT Center comes of age where we are taken seriously some positive changes may come to WDW.

Comes of age? We're in the sweet 18-35 age bracket that marketers fall all over themselves to appeal to.

The real problem is that Future World used to be full of expensive-to-operate E tickets, and the Eisner administration wanted to change it into more of a Magic Kingdom-type park with a small number of E-tickets and a greater number of lower-cost A-D ticket rides. I think we underestimate the effect of the Euro Disney debacle, as well. Remeber, right before Euro Disney opened, Eisner and his people had big, expensive plans for other properties (read up on WestCOT sometime; it was like a Dubai version of EPCOT Center). It wasn't until after Euro Disney failed that the company started to go into aggressive cost-cutting mode.

Had the Paris resort been the grand success that Eisner and co. expected, then quite likely the 1994 Horizons refurb would have happened, The Living Seas would not have become dilapidated due to lack of maintenance, and the 1998 Imagination refurb would have updated and "plussed" the pavilion, rather than gutting it and installing that A-ticket atrocity.

mindflipper · Post by **mindflipper** » Dec Mon 07, 2009 6:41 pm

The whole Euro Disney problems was over-hyped media blitz. They made it out worse than it was. Press made a big deal it didn't break even after the first year. Given the start-up costs for a new theme-park that's much to ask. Universal Studios in Florida didn't - so what was the big deal that Euro Disney didn't?

Did you forget about Disney's America? Wanted to build it on a civil war battlesite? All the protest movements against Disney? I wonder if that could have caused Disney to re-evaluate its theme park plans. Don't forget the Long Beach theme-park fell through too (and those plans eventually grew into the DisneySea over at TDL).

One thing that really doomed WESTCOT: it was seriously under-estimated for its original costs. When reality set in, that killed it from being built, which is why we got the cheaper to build DCA.

parkfam4 · Post by **parkfam4** » Dec Wed 09, 2009 4:12 pm

Speaking of Wonders of Life, (which operates seasonally... I am still waiting for the season to open) does anyone know why it is never open? Is it a staff issue? Money issue? or something else?

Future Guy · Post by **Future Guy** » Dec Wed 09, 2009 4:45 pm

parkfam4 wrote:Speaking of Wonders of Life, (which operates seasonally... I am still waiting for the season to open) does anyone know why it is never open? Is it a staff issue? Money issue? or something else?

Wonders of Life is gone. Oh, the building is still there, but it's only used for events like the Food and Wine festival. The attractions don't operate any more. As to why the pavilion no longer operates, the "official" reason is that Disney couldn't "afford" to operate it any longer after MetLife pulled out.

However, the real reason (and by "real" I mean that I made it up) is that the executives simply had to have solid platinum toilets installed in the executive restrooms (and gold-foil Charmin, too) and the money had to come from somewhere.

MmeLeota · Post by **MmeLeota** » Dec Wed 09, 2009 5:00 pm

I know I'm dreaming, but I still have hope that 6 generations from now, when CA gets the "third park", they will dust off the plans for WESTCOT and make a fabulous idea a reality.

Future Guy · Post by **Future Guy** » Dec Wed 09, 2009 5:11 pm

I was reading about WestCOT the other day, and it was crazy! It was like EPCOT if it had been built in Dubai (minus the slave labor, of course). It would have been awesome, no question, but I just can't imagine that a project that insanely ambitious could actually get built unless a fabulously wealthy eccentric funded it.

If you think about it, it's really an indictment of our economic system that the Pontiac Aztek got built but WestCOT didn't.

Subsonic Radio

What EPCOT refurb never should have happened?

What ride/show should have been left alone?